User Talk:LouisAragon
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About your comment on my page

About your comment on my personal page: "Your edits appear to be disruptive and have been or will be reverted."; consider answering few questions: 1. Are you fluent in Persian language? 2. What is your experties in assessing and considering ethnicity of historical sources written in their era? 3. What is your experties to accuse users' edit as disruptive if based on historical sources someone is not Gilak but was living in Gilan? 4. Is this "Disruptive" for you to recognize presence of diversity and multiculturalism in Gilan and/or any other country like Spain and Galicia? (Practically you have been inconvinience about presence of diversity and heros from different ethnicity in Gilan) 5. In your mindset are 100% of your local people in Spain ethnically from just one ethnicity?

Mirza Kuchik Khan ethnically was a Kurd from Rashvan/Reshvan/Rashvand Clan. Historically, it has been recorded by the governor of his paternal birthplace. I already referred to the original document. However, like any other region chauvinism exists, also in Gilan. The presence of immmigrants in this region has been ignored and rejected by Gilak seperatists and chauvinists. This is due to historical incidents. The last locally independent governor in Gilan was suppresed by central government. Later, central governments forced Kurds to move to this area to control the main logistic road to Gilan. As a result, for centuries Gilan has been part of Iranian territories without any dispute.

Regards Zandwiki (talk) 04:58, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Congratulations from the Military History Project

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On behalf of the Military History Project, I am proud to present the The Milhist reviewing award (1 stripe) for participating in 2 reviews between April and June 2019 Peacemaker67 (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 03:03, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

Keep track of upcoming reviews. Just copy and paste {{WPMILHIST Review alerts}} to your user space

az:?ablon:Qafqaz Albaniyas? knyazlar?

Hi. I am currently reediting rulers of Albania template in azwiki. I could only find names of Varsken and Khosrow II as appointed satraps of Albania by Sasanid kings. Do you know the names of others?--Abutalub (talk) 15:52, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

Hi Abutalub. Thank you for your message. That's a good question right there. Perhaps HistoryofIran can help you out. He knows much more about Sasanian history/historiography than I do. - LouisAragon (talk) 15:26, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

emirate of arabistan

hi are you admin? i need your help. i'm editig this Emirate of Arabistan and most of info are does not match with Khuzestan Province and History of Khuzestan Province. this article sounds like a pan-arab agenda to remove iranian roots of khuzestan region and reprenting it as a always-arab region. article is biased and not neutral. the used references are not written by historians. please check it out. (talk) 12:50, 10 July 2019 (UTC)


Louis, please stop messing around with ANI and archived discussion Aykhan Zayedzadeh. The bot did nothing wrong, and your restoration of the discussion out-of-date order on ANI is disruptive. If you want to pursue this, I suggest (1) you raise it at AN, not ANI, and (2) do so with a link to the ANI archive, don't restore it from ANI. Thanks.--Bbb23 (talk) 17:53, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

@Bbb23: Yeah, I couldn't figure why the bot was archiving that particular section over and over. Sorry. If I want to pursue this at AN, do I need to rewrite another introduction, or would 1-2 sentences + a link to ANI be sufficient? - LouisAragon (talk) 18:02, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
I believe it was archiving properly per the standard time frames at ANI, which, btw, are shorter than AN, but no matter. I would start with a few sentences and a link.--Bbb23 (talk) 18:14, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

new name of Tractor Sazi

hi.if you can read persian, you shoould read this: Talk:Tractor_S.C.#the_new_name_is_just_"tractor"_not_"tractor_azerbaijan"

the new name is just "tractor" or "tractor sport club". also nobody calls it "red wolves". this Tractor_S.C.#Fans is madeup content. some users try to make this article political and ethnocentrist agenda.GGBarBar (talk) 15:16, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

@GGBarBar: Hi there, thank you for your message. Yeah I'm well aware of this WP:NOTHERE mission created by a handful of people. I believe the "South Azerbaijani Wikipedia" and social media is used to mobilize new accounts and off-wiki support. Having said that, "Winterchillz" has now been reported for persistent disruptive editing.[1] I can't read Persian, but if you notice bogus in the article that is not supported by the Persian source (i.e. a violation of WP:VER), please do correct the material with an appropriate edit summary. Best, - LouisAragon (talk) 15:23, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
i am new here and i can not edit protected articles. asked for permission but a moderator said i should wait to gain it; 4 days or less. azeri resource and persian resource are low quality projects. while persian resource is full of errors and bad references, it is still better then azeri, turkish and arabic counterparts because the 3s suffer heavily from ethnicistic agenda. azeri resource is a big forum or a blog with multiple users rather thon an encyclopedia project. and agreed. they launch attack from those wikipedias and social media and they come to here.i will edit iran|iranian topics and may i ask your future help? because im newbie and my english skill is basic.GGBarBar (talk) 18:25, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

Vandalism on Tractor S.C. Page


It's been a few days since we saw the abusive vandalism on the page of the popular Azerbaijani team in Iran. Most of these sabotage are done by User:GGBarBar and User:Shahin. By abusing opposition to racism, these people are trying to destroy the right information about the team. Even in their recent edits, they have also removed the names of the players in the team, which indicates my case. Please stop them from acting.

Thanks -- Preceding unsigned comment added by Loriserforc (talk o contribs) 11:53, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

Safavid Shirvan

Hello LouisAragon. As of decline of the Shirvanshahs' State in 1538, I think the real time of Safavid Shirvan's establishment can be in 1538. Also Shirvan was under Ottoman occupation from 1583 to 1607, so I suggest to change the Shirvan's lifespan as follows: 1538-1583<br>1607-1736. What is your opinion? Benyamin-ln (talk) 21:25, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

@Benyamin-ln: Hey, excuse me for my belated response. When Ismail I deposed Farrukh Yassar in 1500 and subdued Shirvan, he allowed members of the Shirvanshah royal line to rule Shirvan under Safavid suzerainty. In 1538, Tahmasp I decided to compeltely depose the Shirvanshah royals and established a fully functioning province. The article (Safavid Shirvan) should cover the entire period when Shirvan was under Safavid suzerainty, be it as a vassal state or a province. I will probably adjust/expand the article in the future. Cheers, - LouisAragon (talk) 20:49, 13 August 2019 (UTC)
I got. Thanks. Benyamin-ln (talk) 10:35, 14 August 2019 (UTC)
@Benyamin-ln: You're very welcome. - LouisAragon (talk) 12:16, 14 August 2019 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Ariarathes I of Cappadocia

The article Ariarathes I of Cappadocia you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold Symbol wait.svg. The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Ariarathes I of Cappadocia for issues which need to be addressed. Constantine ? 18:08, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Aliqoli Jadid-ol-Eslam

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Aliqoli Jadid-ol-Eslam you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. Time2wait.svg This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Cerebellum -- Cerebellum (talk) 18:21, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Aliqoli Jadid-ol-Eslam

The article Aliqoli Jadid-ol-Eslam you nominated as a good article has passed Symbol support vote.svg; see Talk:Aliqoli Jadid-ol-Eslam for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Cerebellum -- Cerebellum (talk) 18:42, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

Persian Gulf and Fars province

Hi. Considering Persian_Gulf#Name, what do you think about [2] & [3]? You reverted similar edits of this user before, e.g. connecting Fars/Persia to a specific historical region or modern province of Iran. I reverted my revert because that user always restore his stuff. --Wario-Man (talk) 13:38, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

Another WP:TENDENTIOUS case. Called our warning messages "childish"[4] and continuing edit warring.[5] --Wario-Man (talk) 05:43, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: Good to see you're back again. Hope all is well with you and yours. As for the user in question, he should be reported the very next time he makes a disruptive edit. A lot of WP:ROPE has been given over the past few months, to no avail. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:21, 7 August 2019 (UTC)
Thanks, sometimes it's better to leave WP and rest for a while. But the problem is when you return, you may need to browse all previously watched articles for issues again. I have cleared my watchlist so it takes some time to restore my normal activity. You're right and I agree with you. That user is not interested in WP way of collaboration. BTW, take a look at this user and their edits; could be another sockpuppet or just a newbie. Cheers! --Wario-Man (talk) 06:21, 8 August 2019 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: Yes, that user is pursuing the same disruptive narrative as this one. Both are pursuing single-purpose "I NeEd tO FiX ThiS" missions, and are clearly not here to actually build this encyclopedia. The second one is hanging by a thin rope since a long period of time.[6] - LouisAragon (talk) 18:09, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
Perhaps a sticky should be written about the main "narratives" which get imported on a constant basis into the Balkans/Middle East/Caucasus/Central Asia topic area. Could be useful for posterity. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:05, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

Another WP:GHBH: Special:Contributions/Xyvania and Special:Contributions/Trxch. Better review sockmaster's edits. --Wario-Man (talk) 04:25, 14 August 2019 (UTC)


Hi mate, what was the name of the place called again that helps with copyediting articles? I feel like Hormizd IV needs it. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:35, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

Perhaps Resource: WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors or WP:CE? --Biscuit-in-Chief :-) (TalkContribs) 14:56, 15 August 2019 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Yep, Biscuit beat me to it. Here's the direct link to the request page. PS: You can nominate up to two articles at the same time. - LouisAragon (talk) 15:15, 15 August 2019 (UTC)
Little life hack I've just found; If you change the country code of a Google Book, say to or etc, you'll be able to view different pages that were originally unable to be viewed in said language. --HistoryofIran (talk) 03:30, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Awesome, I didn't know! - LouisAragon (talk) 12:29, 24 August 2019 (UTC)

Btw, you don't happen to possess some sources to fully expand/fix Mirian III of Iberia? --HistoryofIran (talk) 16:00, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: With an emphasis on Mirian III himself? I guess the main sources are The Cambridge History of Iran in addition to the ouevre of Cyril Toumanoff. Perhaps @Kober: is aware of new works/sources? - LouisAragon (talk) 18:51, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
Some stuff I found on JSTOR.[7]-[8]-[9] - LouisAragon (talk) 18:51, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
Hi there. I am not aware of any newly published source specifically dealing with Mirian. One relatively recent publication more or less narrowly focused on Mirian in a Christianization context is as follows: Christopher Haas (2008). "Mountain Constantines: The Christianization of Aksum and Iberia". Journal of Late Antiquity. 1 (1): 101-126. doi:10.1353/jla.0.0010.. Otherwise, Stephen Rapp's 2014 opus The Sasanian World through Georgian Eyes: Caucasia and the Iranian Commonwealth in Late Antique Georgian Literature deals extensively with Georgian-Iranian bonds of Sasanian era. Also, I would advice against taking Mirian's Mihranid origin as an undisputed truth. Toumanoff's theory about his origin is probable, but not certain. This is not to deny his Persian genealogy, but evidence for his Mihranid descent is rather circumstantial. --KoberTalk 19:17, 4 September 2019 (UTC)


Let us find solution for Aras question on article talk page Analitikos (talk) 00:15, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

Mazanderani people and Scythians/Amardi origins

Hi. Can you confirm this?[10] Also see Talk:Scythians#Descent_claims. One of the provided ref is reliable and you can access its content via Google Books. I'm OK with adding such claim to the article but NPOV is necessary. According to cited sources on Mazanderani people, that ethnic group is very native to Iran and Caspian Sea region (origin, language, genetics and etc). So I don't want this Scythian claim brings future issues; e.g. someone spamming "Mazanderanis were/are Scythian!". If you have some sources about this claim, can you summarize them? Or just summarize and add content provided by the that user. --Wario-Man (talk) 04:23, 25 August 2019 (UTC)

Erivan khanate

Why do you regularly remove my adjustment to "Erivan khanate" topic? I added that "Erivan khanate was a Turkic khanate." However, you removed it and asked for citation and source. There is the list of names of khans. You can see the tribe name - Qajar at the end of names. Also, editors added citation for list of khans' names (rulers) of Erivan khanate that can apply to the origin of dynasty. Majority of population consist of Turkic tribes as well and it is one of the best evidences of turkicness of Erivan khanate SafaviNihad (talk) 11:01, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

You are inserting original research and non-WP:RS material.[11]-[12]-[13]-[14] This is disruptive editing. - LouisAragon (talk) 11:53, 31 August 2019 (UTC)


Your GA nomination of Ariarathes I of Cappadocia

The article Ariarathes I of Cappadocia you nominated as a good article has passed Symbol support vote.svg; see Talk:Ariarathes I of Cappadocia for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Cplakidas -- Cplakidas (talk) 12:41, 25 October 2019 (UTC)

A favour?

Hi Louis. You seem to be keeping busy. You may, dimly, remember reviewing Battle of Cape Ecnomus when it was at ACR. It is now up for FAC, so if you would care to have another look at it - here - it would be much appreciated. Obviously, if you lack the time or inclination, that is fine. Thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 12:15, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

@Gog the Mild:. This weekend, in all likelihood! If you have more requests, please don't hesitate to let me know (at any point). - LouisAragon (talk) 20:58, 8 November 2019 (UTC)
Hi Louis. Thanks, but there has been a sudden rush of reviewers, so as you were. If you do feel an irresistible desire to review something, then Battle of Lagos is at ACR Face-smile.svg.
If you have anything that needs copy editing or reviewing, let me know. I always find your articles interesting. Gog the Mild (talk) 23:34, 8 November 2019 (UTC)

Sophene, Gordyene, and Adiabene: Three Regna Minora of Northern Mesopotamia Between East and West

Have you seen this source? It has some very interesting and fresh information (especially about Sophene). A must read imho. --HistoryofIran (talk) 18:30, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

ArbCom 2019 election voter message

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Google Code-In 2019 is coming - please mentor some documentation tasks!


Google Code-In, Google-organized contest in which the Wikimedia Foundation participates, starts in a few weeks. This contest is about taking high school students into the world of opensource. I'm sending you this message because you recently edited a documentation page at the English Wikipedia.

I would like to ask you to take part in Google Code-In as a mentor. That would mean to prepare at least one task (it can be documentation related, or something else - the other categories are Code, Design, Quality Assurance and Outreach) for the participants, and help the student to complete it. Please sign up at the contest page and send us your Google account address to, so we can invite you in!

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You might be interested

Check this out. --Kansas Bear (talk) 00:50, 16 December 2019 (UTC)

Happy New Year!

- Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year}} to user talk pages.

creating page

Hello how are you? Can you please help me in the page? Alirazaabbass (talk) 00:09, 18 January 2020 (UTC)

Hi, just keep on editing as you wish. These people are serving Iranian and to some extent Armenian interests by removing all Azerbaijani edits. Don't pay attention! Aydan B-va (talk) 14:36, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

Please refrain from battleground comments. Considering your editing history; using non neutral sources to push your POV, forum like comments on talk pages, or using no sources at all, you should worry about your own inability to edit neutrally. --Kansas Bear (talk) 14:53, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

Editing page Battle of Saragarhi

I am not going to revert or change the edits of others. I am adding my change only. Thanks. WorldWikiAuthorOriginal (talk) 00:09, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

Articles Regarding Azerbaijan History

Hi Louise,

Hope you are doing well. I got your notice regarding sanction. I am wondering how I can write articles about Azerbaijan history or report it if it is biased or irrelevant?

Thanks for your help Mirhasanov (talk) 21:28, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

Brill access?

Can you read this article?

Does it say anything about the Hammudids? --Kansas Bear (talk) 04:56, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

Unfortunately not, at the moment. I purchase access like once or twice a year when tons of new entries get published. Perhaps you could ask Cplakidas; he has permanent access. - LouisAragon (talk) 03:41, 8 February 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: [15] - LouisAragon (talk) 05:43, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

What do you think about this?

This [16] sounds WP:OR and WP:POV. Looks like a WP:POVFORK of this article. Your thoughts? --Wario-Man (talk) 14:49, 12 February 2020 (UTC)

And this one --Wario-Man (talk) 07:20, 17 February 2020 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: Yes to both of your questions. Disruptive WP:OR. Long-term disruption[17]-[18]-[19] by a "user" who's edits (many of them) are a clear violation WP:AA2. He has managed to evade proper sanctions by editing irregularly in combination with large time intervals. - LouisAragon (talk) 19:03, 22 February 2020 (UTC)
Are his edits some kind of anachronism and historical revisionism? --Wario-Man (talk) 08:18, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: Both. He often uses Soviet/Tsarist/Azerbaijan Rep. sources (unreliable in relation to these topics) to "cover" his edits. - LouisAragon (talk) 21:57, 27 February 2020 (UTC)

Another WP:OR

This article sounds WP:OR too. Hoax? --Wario-Man (talk) 10:45, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: Part truth,(page 90; [20]) together with a lot of WP:OR. - LouisAragon (talk) 16:10, 19 April 2020 (UTC)

Charles Christie (officer)


The copy edit you requested from the Guild of Copy Editors of the article Charles Christie (officer) has been completed.

Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns.


Twofingered Typist (talk) 13:32, 29 February 2020 (UTC)

@Twofingered Typist: Hi. I have a question. Shouldn't you, per MOS:NBSP, be using {{nbsp}} instead of HTML (outside wikilinks, of course)? --Biscuit-in-Chief :-) (/t?:k//'k?ntbs/) 14:22, 29 February 2020 (UTC)
@Biscuit-in-Chief: I have always used HTML and see this in virtually every article where the space is required. It appears either markup is acceptable from my reading except the wikilinks mention. Twofingered Typist (talk) 14:34, 29 February 2020 (UTC)

New Persian in the lede of Sasanian kings?

I'm wondering if I should just remove the New Persian spelling of all Sasanian kings in the lead (will keep it in the Name/Etymology section), since it's kinda contradictory compared to all the other articles I edit (Kings of Armenia, Parthia etc) and just generally other articles as well. --HistoryofIran (talk) 21:39, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: Yes that sounds like a good idea. While avoiding anachronisms in the lead, readers will understand through the very first alinea of the body that there's a high degree of continuity between the forms (MP vs NP), with many of the names being still used up to this day in their NP forms. - LouisAragon (talk) 23:09, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


Hiya. Seems like my JSTOR subscription has run out or something. I can't access the works there anymore. You don't happen to remember where I can apply for a subscription? --HistoryofIran (talk) 01:17, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: Yeah sounds like your sub ended. Here is the JSTOR link. Oh and just in case; here you can find a list of all databases Wiki offers. - LouisAragon (talk) 02:34, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Problem on Genghis Khan page

Hello, I wanted to inform you that there is a huge misinterpretation of a reference linked to Rashin al-dins work. He did not state that Genghis had red hair (or blue eyes). Here is the direct quote:

"It so happened that two months prior to Mögä's [the son of Kublai's nurse] birth, Qubilai Qa'an [Kublai Khan] was born, and when Genghis Khan's gaze fell upon him he said, "Our [Chinggis Khan's] sons are all of a ruddy complexion, but this boy [Kublai] is swarthy, just like his maternal uncles. Tell Sorqaghtani Beki [Kublai's mother] to give him to a good nurse to be brought up by."" -Rashid al-Din/Thackston translation, 415.

"It chanced that he was born 2 months before Möge, and when Chingiz-Khan's eye fell upon him he said: "all our children are of a ruddy complexion, but this child is swarthy like his maternal uncles. Tell Sorqoqtani Beki to give him to a good nurse to be reared."" -Rashid al-Din/Boyle translation, 241.

Here the link to the reference:

Ruddy skin means reddish skin not hair. And nowhere are blue eyes mentioned. Can you please correct this misinterpretation. Thank you. (talk) 12:48, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

Way back when

While obviously nobody is nostalgic for this time, there is something to be said for two peoples who once were good friends, and that was not just about restoring the temple [[21]]. Thought you might be interested. Maybe also HistoryofIran. Cheers! --Calthinus (talk) 18:18, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

@Calthinus: That is some really nice information, thank you very much. Certainly looking forward to when this admirable friendship will be restored in the future in a better time. --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:46, 10 April 2020 (UTC)
@Calthinus: Yes I knew about the story, though I never knew there were that many Jews amongst them. Thanks for sending! - LouisAragon (talk) 15:16, 17 April 2020 (UTC)


Could you read Antoine, Duke of Lorraine and Jovian (emperor) and give me your thoughts/perspective? Thanks in advance. --Kansas Bear (talk) 14:41, 12 April 2020 (UTC)

@Kansas Bear: Both are of GA quality, so you should take the shot IMO. Concise and well written. - LouisAragon (talk) 15:20, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
Thank you for taking the time to read them. I know how busy you are right now. Stay safe and healthy. --Kansas Bear (talk) 15:34, 17 April 2020 (UTC)
Thanks again for your assistance. Both passed GA. --Kansas Bear (talk) 18:23, 23 April 2020 (UTC)

Steverci sock?

Biainili (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log)
Biainili, with 52 edits, makes this statement, "Kansas Bear, you can do whatever you want, just stop polluting my Talk page with your idiotic statements, if you keep reverting my edits, at the behest of your resource friends, you will be reported."

Said user is now stalking my edits, using a false edit summary to remove references added, since they refuse to use the article talk pages in their vain attempt to remove anything to do with Iran, Iranians, Zoroastrianism, etc, etc.[22][23] It is clear they know how to cite sources, clearly they can not handle what sources say.

Extremely anti-Iranian, removing Encyclopaedia Iranica source(s).[24], false edit summary, POV editing Steverci has done the same(removing an Encyclopaedia Iranica source).

Has 52 edits and can write references like this.[25][26]

Their fifth edit was to write a reference(ie. cite book format), not once but twice. AND, replacing a reference with the word Iran in the title. Talk about insecure! LOL. --Kansas Bear (talk) 18:38, 18 April 2020 (UTC)



I don't know If I'm supposed to defend myself here, but since I got a notification telling me that someone mentioned my name, here we go...

First of all, I have no idea about who the user Steverci is, but this is my one and only account here on Wikipedia, and the fact that I have only 52 edits has nothing to with this, thus cannot be used as an argument.

Secondly, get your facts straight before making false accusations about me, I'm definitely not anti-Iranian whatsoever, I'm not really interested in Iranian related resource pages to begin with.

Also, I think it's worth to mention that I have absolutely nothing against you(Kansas Bear), but you reverted my 6 edit, with an edit summary "restored referenced information, take your concerns to the talk page", despite the fact that I explained several times that the sources are not about the claim itself, if you had bothered to take a look at the sources you would understand why I removed the them. Anyway, looking at your edit history, since you know better than everyone else, we surely have a lot to learn from you(!), but you did the exact same mistake that you keep lecturing everyone, if you have doubts on the credibility of sources then you should take your concerns to the talk page, be more careful next time.

Finally, this tension is an outcome of constant falsifications of Armenian resource pages by notorious u/HistoryofIran.Biainili (talk) 19:26, 18 April 2020 (UTC)

  • "Finally, this tension is an outcome of constant falsifications of Armenian resource pages by notorious u/HistoryofIran."
These "falsifications", of which you posted zero times on the relevant article talk page(s), to start a discussion. So instead of starting a discussion you chose to harass another editor, yeah clearly shows your ability to edit neutrally, not. --Kansas Bear (talk) 20:13, 18 April 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: @LouisAragon: I'm starting to get rather bored now [27]. What's the name of the place that I can report him? My memory's shite. HistoryofIran (talk)
@Kansas Bear: @HistoryofIran: Remember?[28] Also this[29] - LouisAragon (talk) 13:18, 21 April 2020 (UTC)
Nice work, LouisAragon! --Kansas Bear (talk) 15:24, 21 April 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: @HistoryofIran: [30] - LouisAragon (talk) 18:08, 23 April 2020 (UTC)

ANI notice not left by thread starter

Information icon There is currently a discussion at Resource: Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is Hell on earth with u/HistoryOfIran. Nil Einne (talk) 08:52, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

Armenian Highlands

Thank you for this one[31]. You will upgrade from LOL to ROTFL when you have a look at this:Talk:Armenoid race#Origin. The same editor propagates Coon's Races of Europe (1939) as a reliable source. "Outdated" maybe refers to everything that doesn't fit into a Blut und Boden-POV. -Austronesier (talk) 09:44, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

Austronesier and LouisAragon, I think this user is related to ( They both label other editors or edits as "vandalism" despite there is no vandalism and they both edit on same topic areas (ancient kingdoms in Anatolia like Sophone, Orontid,Urartu...and Iranian and Armenian topics) and both of their usernames are related to Urartu and Hurrians, such as "Khaldi" (), Biainili. (talk) 22:05, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

Request for comment

Would you please comment on this?

Authors of that work, reviewing linked source and it content, and other claims/stuff. Really need your opinion. Thanks. --Wario-Man (talk) 05:55, 17 June 2020 (UTC) Hallo menner LouisAragon waarom heeft u mijn teksten verwijderd ondanks allemaal waar zijn? ik wordt blij als u uitlegt vriendelijk bedankt -- Preceding unsigned comment added by Keywan faramarzi (talk o contribs) 08:25, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

Category:Achaemenid satraps of Magnesia has been nominated for merging

Category:Achaemenid satraps of Magnesia has been nominated for merging. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:18, 19 June 2020 (UTC)

Category:Balasagan has been nominated for deletion

Category:Balasagan has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:52, 12 July 2020 (UTC)


Hi. I saw your removals. You better review these sections too: Etymology, Origins, and Ethnogenesis. There are some dubious and questionable stuff there; e.g. connecting Turkmens to Sogdia, Sogdians, and Parthians and representing those ancient peoples as Turkic. The user added problematic stuff like this. --Wario-Man (talk) 06:21, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: Yes. His edits are filled with bogus material and extremely questionable "sources". - LouisAragon (talk) 13:53, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Reliability of Sources

If the reliability of Leonie Freida is based on the cited usage of her work then Kaveh Farrokh's works should also be considered reliable sources.

  • Iran at War:1500-1988. [32] cited by 62. Cited by Princeton University.
  • A Synopsis of Sasanian Military Organization and Combat Units. [33] cited by 6. Cited by Cambridge University Journal, Anatolian Studies.
  • The Armies of Ancient Persia: The Sassanians. [34] cited by 9. Cite by Oxford University.
  • Shadows in the Desert: Ancient Persia at War. [35] cited by 172. Edinburgh University Press.
  • The Siege of Amida (359 CE). [36] cite by 2. Cited by Historia i ?wiat.

Just to name a few. Hope things are going well for you in university. Stay safe. --Kansas Bear (talk) 22:51, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

book access

Hello LouisAragon. How can I access to the full-text of this and this useful books? I need these books :) Benyamin (talk) 12:53, 12 August 2020 (UTC)

@Benyamin: Hey. You'd have to purchase both of them as far as I know. I don't think you can find them for free on the internet; at least, I couldn't back in the day. Amazon does support a "Look Inside" feature for the second book (Titles & Emoluments in Safavid Iran: A Third Manual of Safavid Administration), which gives access to some pages (even more when you make an Amazon account). But still I'd really recommend buying both books if you want proper access. They're both really useful books. Btw, in September 2020 Willem Floor, the same author, will publish another major work on all Safavid offices and the Safavid government.[37] - LouisAragon (talk) 17:02, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
If you need some specific pages I can maybe make pictures for you as I have both books in my possession (i.e. if you decide against buying the entire work @ Amazon). Please don't hesitate to let me know! :-) - LouisAragon (talk) 17:04, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
Forgive me for delaying in response. I'd spent last week to work on Safavid Talish. In fact, I'm looking for the above mentioned books to use in this article. In addition to them, I'm looking for the detail-discussed work on the matter.
Good news! Waiting for his new book and hope that the latter would be downloadable. We make many citations for such books in Wikipedia. LOL :)))
It's interesting. I don't know that Amazon previews some books. Unfortunately, 149-150 and 230 are not in this preview. May I invite you to contribute in the article by the specified pages? Benyamin (talk) 21:55, 22 August 2020 (UTC)
@Benyamin: Sure, I will do that! - LouisAragon (talk) 13:37, 17 September 2020 (UTC)

Your opinion

When you have time, could you read through Philip III of France and give your opinion if it is GA material? Thanks. --Kansas Bear (talk) 18:32, 16 August 2020 (UTC)

@Kansas Bear: Cursory look: perhaps you could add a bit more information to the lede? I'll have a more thorough read later today. - LouisAragon (talk) 00:18, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
Yeah, I thought that as well. HoI's suggestion has spurred my investigation into the treaty Philip signed with Navarre. I think I have a little farther to go to get it to GA. Thank you very much! --Kansas Bear (talk) 00:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: You should go ahead and nominate it, IMO. Its GA quality (had a thorough read this time). - LouisAragon (talk) 21:45, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: Found a cool image for your article.[38] It apparently depicts Philip III leading a funeral procession with the remains of his father Louis IX. - LouisAragon (talk) 22:05, 19 August 2020 (UTC)
Nice pic! I am going to try and find some information concerning Philip III and treaty with Navarre. Give the article a little more depth. My sincerest thanks on the work you have done, sir! Hey, stay cool over there! It is 19.44C here tonight. --Kansas Bear (talk) 04:08, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Oxford Reference

Hiya mate, hope everything is alright. It seems I don't have access to Oxford Reference [39] anymore, however, I can't find it in [40]. I'm probably doing something wrong, thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:10, 13 September 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: I believe this is what you're looking for?[41] - LouisAragon (talk) 13:36, 17 September 2020 (UTC)
Yes, but it seems I can't apply for access. --HistoryofIran (talk) 15:21, 17 September 2020 (UTC)
You've got mail :d. --HistoryofIran (talk) 16:41, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Replied. Btw, it seems the Iranica staff has some internal problems which explains why they havent published new online entries in a long time. Brill has taken over the online publishing thing though. The new fasc includes 11 (!) entries on Khorasan.[42] - LouisAragon (talk) 02:00, 2 December 2020 (UTC)


Hey LouisAragon, I think you'll find this new "Encylopedia of islam, ed. 3rd" entry ([43]) interesting. Kind Regards. -TheseusHeLl (talk) 05:35, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

@TheseusHeLl: I do, thanks! - LouisAragon (talk) 22:46, 25 September 2020 (UTC)


Hi, I do not speak English well But I would love for Kashmar to be a good article Although I do not know English, I tried a lot in this article And I like this article to be good Anyway, I'm asking for your help I hope you accept and help me, Thank you a world :) M.k.m2003 (talk) 16:51, 16 October 2020 (UTC)

Hi again, You have no answer? Thank you M.k.m2003 (talk) 08:28, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
@M.k.m2003: Hi. I just left a message at the talk page of the Kashmar article.[44] Its nowhere near GA-class unfortunately atm. You've done a really good job on many articles btw, keep up the good work! - LouisAragon (talk) 20:46, 24 October 2020 (UTC)
Hi again, I deleted the template on the talk page, do I have anything else to do? Thank you M.k.m2003 (talk) 06:53, 25 October 2020 (UTC)

I need u help bro

Hi bro, can u help me with this article ? I cann not to write because i have nom many sources. If you help me I will be glad. Thank u bro FaradzhoffEma (talk) 22:42, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

Zangezur Uyezd

Hello. Can you help me with Zangezur Uyezd to Correct everything? Baku2033 (talk) 14:15, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

If by "correct everything" you mean writing material in a way that violates WP:TENDENTIOUS (amongst others), then no, I can't be of any help. - LouisAragon (talk) 19:24, 29 October 2020 (UTC)

Just so you know

See here. --Kansas Bear (talk) 19:59, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


Since you have reported that user, you better review his edits too; e.g. this looks like a source falsification. He did very same thing on a related article. --Wario-Man (talk) 07:29, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: There's a recent surge in WP:TENDENTIOUS pro-Turkic edits on resource by anons and sockpuppets, and I believe its partly due to the recent Armenia-Azerbaijan clashes. - LouisAragon (talk) 15:13, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
Yeah, I have noticed strange amount of nationalistic POV-pushing on several articles. Do you have access to that source and can you review it? It looks fishy. --Wario-Man (talk) 15:18, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: According to A History of Russia, Inner Asia and Mongolia, page 248;"So there were probably many Turkic speakers within the Hephthalite and Hunnic confederations."
Clearly what has been added is a POV version. First there are not "scholars", only David Christian(misrepresentation). It should not be simply Hephthalites, it should be Hephthalite Confederation(per the source, more misrepresentation), AND the word probably is also present(and should be) which is not present in the edit.
So, the entire sentence is misrepresenting what the source actually states. Either removal or a re-write is in order. Something like
  • "According to David Christian, the Hephthalite confederation probably had many Turkic speakers." --Kansas Bear (talk) 18:36, 13 November 2020 (UTC)
@Kansas Bear: Thanks, another editor has already removed that part. Plus that user is a possible sockpuppet by this checkuser result. I'm waiting for the final conclusion of that SPI case. --Wario-Man (talk) 13:28, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Akbar Shah (diamond)

As you have edited articles related to Nader Shah, you may be interested in expanding Akbar Shah (diamond). Laval (talk) 11:25, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

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This is interesting

I thought I had inquired about a certain publisher and author. Oddly enough I never received a response. Nothing like setting someone up to fail!

Another inquiry on the RS noticeboard, note the lack of responses(1).

Another inquiry on the RS noticedboard.

Another inquiry.

Another inquiry.

Any wonder why that particular discussion was held here and not on the RS noticeboard? Something smells rotten in Denmark! --Kansas Bear (talk) 05:38, 30 November 2020 (UTC)


Hiya mate. Perfect timing that you got access to most of Brill's stuff :D Could you by any chance send me [45] [46] and [47] And also [48] and [49] if you have access to them as well as that is? --HistoryofIran (talk) 13:12, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: sent you the Enc of Islam entries and the article from the Journal of Persianate Studies. Please check your mail. I have full access to all chapters of the Cities of Medieval Iran book (in article form), but its like 400+ pages in total. Are there any specific chapters you'd want to have right now? I can send the rest later. - LouisAragon (talk) 23:07, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
Thanks! And yes, I will look into that :). --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:48, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Subutai: Sorting Fact from Fiction Surrounding the Mongol Empire's Greatest General

Hi. Thanks for providing the content. I need a full summary from "1 Questions about Subutai's Origins: Family Members, Tribe, and the Iron Cart" part of that article. e.g. was he a Mongol, Tuvan, Turkic, or XYZ? Reason: edits and claims like [50] and [51]. --Wario-Man (talk) 14:08, 8 December 2020 (UTC)


"In material that details Subutai's family origins, we are very likely to encounter the statement that he was the son of Jarchi'udai the blacksmith and that his brother was Jelme. In the Secret History, Jarchi'udai, a member of the Uriyangqat tribe, appears before Temüjin and hands over his son Jelme as a servant. Later, the text states that Jelme's two brothers, Subutai and Cha'urqan, left their tribe and came to join him.21 Since the Secret History is a well-known text that has been translated into many languages, it is not surprising that we see this story repeated so often. However, it is an error in the strictest sense. Igor de Rachewiltz points out that Jelme was the older cousin of Subutai and Cha'urqan, there being an apparent tendency in the Secret History for younger cousins to be termed younger brothers.22 In fact, as his biographies in the Yuan Shi state, Subutai and his elder brother, who is referred to as Qurghun rather than Cha'urqan, were the sons of a man named Qaban.23 The biographies even share a story that involves all three of them. Admittedly, modern writers who simply repeat what they encounter in an important primary source, the Secret History, can hardly be blamed for the mistake. However, the fact that the correct parental relationship does not show up more often demonstrates that the account in the Yuan Shi is not very widely consulted."

"It also frequently appears in secondary literature that Subutai was of the Reindeer People, since there was a forest-dwelling group of people in the northwest of Mongolia who had the exonym of Uriyangqai, irrespective of whether they were Turkic or Mongolic speakers. Describing these people of the forest, Rashiduddin (Rashid al-Din) notes that they raised wild animals in the forest, travelled on sleds, and loathed the idea of living on the steppe and raising sheep or cattle like typical Mongolian nomads.24 Evidently this description of the Uriyangqai has been attached to Subutai in literature. Moreover, since the tribal name later became associated with the Tuvans, there is a persistent myth that Subutai was Tuvan. However, as Rashiduddin notes elsewhere, the group to which Subutai belonged was "separate and distinct" from the forest people.25 In fact, the clan to which he belonged was the Uriyangqat.26 The very slight difference in the form of the name, and the fact that there exists an obvious etymological connection, has led to much confusion for later scholars. However, the group to which Subutai belonged was situated among the Mongols in the Onon-Kherlen region of northeast Mongolia, closely affiliated with Chinggis Khan's own tribal grouping, and had the practices of steppe nomads. The only detailed story of his youth, recounted in both his Yuan Shi biographies, is that Subutai and his brother rode to rescue their father from robbers while he was herding sheep. The entire narrative unfolds in a very traditionally Mongolian set of circumstances. Perhaps the sense of irony conjured by imagining that the Mongol Empire's greatest general was a reindeer-herding outsider to steppe nomadic culture has a strong literary appeal to modern authors."

"On the topic of irony, there is an occasional statement that still goes around about Subutai having to be carried in an iron cart because of his weight. This originates from references in sources to his being assigned a cart with iron-covered wheels and probably an iron frame when he set out to destroy Merkit refugees.27 It is puzzling that the possession of an iron-reinforced cart should have led to assumptions that Subutai was extremely corpulent, but a clue might come from the information that would have been accessed by scholars in the past couple of centuries who were looking for information on him. In Rashiduddin's description of the Uriyangqat, referenced above, there is a mention of an elderly man who had to be carried everywhere in a cart. More significant is Rashiduddin's description of a grandson of Batu's brother, Orda. This figure, Qonichi, is described as so morbidly obese that guards had to watch him while he slept for fear he would be suffocated. Rashiduddin specifically mentions, "He was so huge that no horse could carry him, so he travelled in a cart."28 This would seem to be the origin of the story. Authors combing the source material came across this reference and equated it with Subutai, since his cart, after all, was reinforced with iron. Perhaps the irony of a man who could not ride a horse becoming the nomadic cavalry's greatest general was part of the appeal of this story."

- LouisAragon (talk) 23:17, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
Very nice, would you please add them to the article? The article has already some of the above info but it does not clarify them. I'm not very good in copy-editing stuff. --Wario-Man (talk) 04:13, 10 December 2020 (UTC)
Also the problematic user MLP050/Shakshak31[52] was a sockpuppet. See Resource: Sockpuppet investigations/Smokva26. Seems that user has multiple active, inactive, blocked, and sleeper accounts. --Wario-Man (talk) 04:43, 10 December 2020 (UTC)


Hello, what is the reason for deleting my edit in the pages related to Azerbaijan and Azeri? Atropatene is the ancient name of the region of Azerbaijan. Please dont delete my edit. Thank you. -- Preceding unsigned comment added by Mohammad785 (talk o contribs) 15:11, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

You forgot this

See this. Cheers! --Wario-Man (talk) 05:55, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

New Cambridge Modern History

Not sure if you had a link for most of the volumes. --Kansas Bear (talk) 20:58, 18 December 2020 (UTC)

Season's Greetings

Weihnachten10.gif Season's Greetings
Santa on reindeer.gif
Wishing you a Happy Holiday Season, and a beautiful and productive New Year! ? Pat (talk) 16:22, 21 December 2020 (UTC)
@?: Thanks and likewise!! - LouisAragon (talk) 21:19, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays

Wikipedia Happy New Year.png Merry Christmas and a Prosperous 2021!

Hello LouisAragon, may you be surrounded by peace, success and happiness on this seasonal occasion. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Sending you heartfelt and warm greetings for Christmas and New Year 2021.
Happy editing,

Wario-Man (talk) 13:41, 25 December 2020 (UTC)

Spread the love by adding {{subst:Seasonal Greetings}} to other user talk pages.

@Wario-Man: Thanks and likewise!! - LouisAragon (talk) 21:19, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Reporting edit vandalism

Hi! A user by the name of "Semsûrî" is adding Kurdish to the Lorestan province of Iran with no reference only based on Kurdish nationalism. Based on references this province 91.5% of this province speaks Luri.[1]

Please help to stop this vandalism. Thanks Emblemmor (talk) 06:32, 26 December 2020 (UTC)


A barnstar for you!

Original Barnstar Hires.png The Original Barnstar
Hi LouisAragon. I write with admiration for the Marzban-Nama page. Great update/relaunch. I made some minor edits-- and somehow it created footnotes, don't understand what happened. Please let me know how to fix, apologies for the problem. SnowGoating (talk) 17:37, 30 December 2020 (UTC) --UPDATE-- I figured it out, and fixed it. Thanks, SnowGoating.
@SnowGoating: Thanks! Checked the page; it appears you changed the date of the Iranica reference from "2000" to "2014". I personally prefer using the original date listed in the Iranica article, which, in this case, was 2000, as an update within Iranica doesn't necessarily mean that the entire article was "updated" (as in, with the most recent information). Best wishes to you and yours btw! If you have any further questions/remarks, please don't hesitate to let me know. - LouisAragon (talk) 21:24, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi LouisAragon: Regarding the date on the Iranica article, in fact the original publication date is 2014 (there was no entry prior to this date). Encyclopedia Iranica is in the midst of computer programming default syndrome. The January 1 2000 is the default. This is only temporary until it is sorted which will be in the near future. Another system some people use is also the date one has accessed the (online) article - but being that this article will be going into print soon, perhaps the original (albeit presently confusing) date of 2014 is best. SnowGoating (talk) 00:18, 3 January 2021 (UTC)
@SnowGoating: Thank you for your thorough explanation. I was unaware of those developments. - LouisAragon (talk) 20:18, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

Titles & Emoluments in Safavid Iran: A Third Manual of Safavid Administration

Hiya mate and happy new year! You don't happen to have Titles & Emoluments in Safavid Iran: A Third Manual of Safavid Administration on you? --HistoryofIran (talk) 19:32, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: To you and yours as well! I have the entire book in my possession, but I don't have it at my disposal right now (as in, I put it in my bookshelf at another place). Are there any specific entries/pages you need? - LouisAragon (talk) 21:18, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
Yup, the entries regarding Gilan, Mazandaran, Khorasan and Persian Iraq would be great. --HistoryofIran (talk) 23:11, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Asir-e Esfahani

Non-constructive edits

Hello, LouisAragon, thanks the update on reverting my edits; Can you please elaborate on your judgment about my edits being non-constructive? The sources I linked to seem to be quite reputable. The page about constructive contributions you linked to, has exactly this statement " because resource is open to editing by anyone, we require that information be verifiable in reliable sources." Mchan12345 20:39, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

(Sorry in advance for the poor formatting - I'm writing this from my phone) I just noticed your revert comment now. First of all, I am quite surprised you utilized words "whitewashing" (as if the subject was a gangster and I was his shady accomplice trying to push an agenda) and concluding by "not a chance" (as if this was an edgy reddit discussion), please try to abstain from emotions. Let's try to be, indeed, constructive.

Now, the constructive part: you said that the subj is praised by his "clique" (as you've put it), but if we assume that he is criticized by a rival "clique", why *à priori* give the "rival clique" higher weight? If anything, the russian sources that I provided at least seem to be stemming from an academic journal. I can't vouch for it having a high impact-factor or a credible reputation, but it's certainly more credible that the source of Ismailov et al which doesn't even stem from an academic paper, rather from a webpage (a blog?).

That being said, I also read the english sources linked in the article which indeed qualify the subject as an "alternative historian". In all fairness, I think these sources only focus on the contestable/negative aspects of the subject's work, and they are fully in the right to do so: they have a point to prove (that "alternative history" serves some kind of political purpose for the modern russian elites, I assume). This, however, completely leaves out of the discussion the positive/uncontested aspects of his work, which I diligently sourced.

Also, I don't think it was constructive to revert the reference I provided for the already existing text in the article. I am talking about the first paragraph of the "reception" section (comment from Serebrennikov etc.).

About changing the lead to a more positive formulation, an argument can be made that in NONE of the other languages for which this page is available, such a negative lead exists, and most of these cite some resources. Mchan12345 21:20, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

Also, do you have a reasonable evidence of the authors I cited forming a "clique" around the subject? That is a rather strong assumption. If you provide the evidence, I will concede (and possibly will search for other, not affiliated sources) Mchan12345 21:39, 15 January 2021 (UTC)

New article by Iranian author

Hi LouisAragon, if you might have time to have a quick look at Zabân-e Pâk (currently at Template:Did you know nominations/Zabân-e Pâk). I can't find either of the first two book sources listed, and so am wondering if they are translations of Persian titles. The topic is certainly interesting, so I do wonder if there might be more sources out there, but I can't find any in English at all. CMD (talk) 03:24, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

@Chipmunkdavis: Hi Chip, hope all is well with you and yours, long time no speak! I can't read/write Persian, but perhaps @Wikaviani: can help out. As for English-language sources, I got numerous hits when performing a cursory Google.books search.[53] Please let me know if you need further assistance. - LouisAragon (talk) 14:55, 18 January 2021 (UTC)
Ah, I searched with the diacritics in the article title and got little of substance. (For some reason that escapes me, I did not think to search without.) On the text, there's a few places I don't quite understand what is being said, and I can't check the sources to clarify. That said, overall it looks fine, although if Wikaviani wants to check I certainly wouldn't object! It's a new topic for me, and our article on linguistic purism only mentions Persian as a corruptor rather than a corruptee, so I found the topic interesting as well as unaddressed. I am well, back to editing regularly again. Hope all is going well with you as well. CMD (talk) 15:17, 18 January 2021 (UTC)
@Chipmunkdavis: I can understand that. Well, Kasravi was a huge figure, far ahead of his time. Unfortunately, his time was cut short by a certain "type of people", who are glorified by the post-1979 Iranian "government". I can edit Kasravi's history-related works using English-language references, but someone who can read Persian is really warranted when dealing with his linguistic works IMHO.
Good to hear! Yeah I'm fine too, just really busy with studies. - LouisAragon (talk) 19:41, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
I would be glad to help if you guys think that my help is still needed. Best.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 20:22, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi Wikaviani, this user has had an unfortunately rough time with their DYK nominations. The Zabân-e Pâk article is currently held up due to the sentence "The movement that Kasravi started, today known as "Sareh Persian", tries to use original Iranian words" being unsourced. The best I've found in English has been language forums which use sareh as an adjective rather than "Sareh Persian" as the name of a movement. Is "Sareh" just a straight transliteration of the Persian word for pure? Would you be able to rewrite that sentence with a reliable source? CMD (talk) 17:36, 23 January 2021 (UTC)
Hi Chipmunkdavis, i'll try to find Persian language sources for that sentence, as soon as i find some time to do so (probably in 2 or 3 weeks, as i'm very busy with real life matters for now). As to the meaning of "sareh Persian", it's a bit dodgy, since while "sareh Persian" means "pure Persian", "Persian sareh" would mean "the mentality of the Persians". Best regards.---Wikaviani (talk) (contribs) 22:56, 25 January 2021 (UTC)

Helpful site

Search for books on this site.[54] --Kansas Bear (talk) 00:57, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

@Kansas Bear: Much appreciated!! - LouisAragon (talk) 16:00, 20 January 2021 (UTC)


I checked the Encyclopaedia of Islam; it does not verify the claim you made: here. Please revert yourself or furnish some kind of evidence. GPinkerton (talk) 13:21, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

According to my copy of Encyclopaedia of Islam, Vol. I, Claude Cahen, page 1350;"Buwayhids or Buyids, the most important of the dynasties which, first in the Iranian plateau then in lraq, side by side with the Samanids of Khurasan and of Mawara* al-Nahr, marked the "Iranian intermezzo" (Minorsky) between the Arab domination of early Islam and the Turkish conquest of the 5th/11th century. Its name derives from Buwayh or Buyeh, the father of three brothers who founded it, 'Ali, al-Hasan, and the youngest, Ahmad. Condottieri of humble birth, they belonged to the population of the Daylamites [q.v.] who, newly won over to (Shi'i) Islam, were at that time enlisting in large numbers in all the armies of the Muslim East, including those of the Caliphate." --Kansas Bear (talk) 14:13, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
C.E. Bosworth, The New Islamic Dynasties, page 155;"Out of the Daylami dynasties which formed in the Persian world as the Abbasid grip over the province of the caliphate weakened, the Buyids were the most powerful...." --Kansas Bear (talk) 15:11, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
@GPinkerton: In addition to the references provided by Kansas Bear:
  • "BUYIDS (also Bowayhids, Buwaihids, etc.; Pers. ?l-e B?ya), dynasty of Daylamite origin ruling over the south and western part of Iran and over Iraq from the middle of the 4th/10th to the middle of the 5th/11th centuries." -- Tilman Nagel (1990). "BUYIDS". Encyclopedia Iranica. Vol. IV, Fasc. 6, pp. 578-586
  • "The B?yids (or Buwayhids, r. 320-454/932-1062) were an Iranian dynasty (...) " -- Blair, Sheila S. (2009). "B?yid art and architecture". In Fleet, Kate; Krämer, Gudrun; Matringe, Denis; Nawas, John; Rowson, Everett (eds.). Encyclopaedia of Islam, THREE. Brill Online. ISSN 1873-9830
  • "Buyids or Buwayhids (?l-i B?ya), an Iranian Shi?i dynasty named after Ab? Shuj B?ya (Buwayh), whose sons and descendants ruled the greater part of Iran, Iraq and the Jaz?ra up to the northern borders of Syria between the years 322-448/933-1056. " -- Sajjadi, Sadeq; Asatryan, Mushegh; Melvin-Koushki, Matthew. "B?yids". In Madelung, Wilferd; Daftary, Farhad (eds.). Encyclopaedia Islamica Online. Brill Online. ISSN 1875-9831
  • "(...) which appear most prominently in the case of the Buyid Daylamite rulers (932-1062/320-454), had in fact begun considerably earlier. " -- Rahmati, Mohsen. (2020). The Saffarid Ya?qub b. Layth and the Revival of Persian Kingship. Journal of Persianate Studies. Brill.
  • "In the Eastern part of the former caliphate, for example, Daylamites from the Southern Caspian shores took over large parts of Iran and Iraq including the Abbasid capital Baghdad. They brought forth the next ruling dynasty of this era, the Shi?ite Buyids. " -- Berkel, Maaike van. (2018). "The People of the Pen: Self-Perceptions of Status and Role in the Administration of Empires and Polities". in Prince, Pen, and Sword: Eurasian Perspectives (Maaike van Berkel and Jeroen Duindam, eds). Brill
  • "Buwayhids (Buyids). Generally considered a Persian dynasty, famous for having captured (...)" -- Michael M. Gunter (2009). The A to Z of the Kurds. p. 30
Although WP:GF assumed, one could even argue that it was a disruptive edit, for the main article, Buyid dynasty, does not even collaborate a Kurdish origin. Why would someone consider it prudent to add a statement contradicted by 1) the majority WP:RS 2) the information written on the dynasty's main article? Syrian Kurdistan is furthermore covered by discretionary sanctions as far as I can see. I'm assuming it was a mistake, but people should tread carefully and read WP:GAME. - LouisAragon (talk) 16:18, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
LouisAragon, Kansas Bear to play devil's advocate, none of these sources actually supports the claim The Buyids, per the utter vast majority historians, Iranologists, Kurdologists and Middle-Eastern studies scholars (incl. Enc. of Islam, etc.) were not Kurds and none directly contradicts the statement made by the source cited, which is that The most significant and famous of the Kurdish dynasties were the Buwayhids (932-1062) and the Ayyubids (1171-1260). It does not strike me as impossible that a Kurdish dynasty might be Shi?ite or Persian/Iranian. I don't think argumentum ex silentio is a valid line of reasoning and I think all Kurds can be described as Persian or Iranian on the basis of the language family tree, so I don't see where Michael M. Gunter's A-Z of the Kurds should be wrong when it states that Some Kurdish scholars argue, however, that the Buwayhids were descended from the Kurdish Dailamites, or Dilami, who had established a number of different kingdoms. Gunter's phrasing suggests that it is the Buwayhids' descent from the Daylamites that is in contention, not that the Daylamites were Kurdish(-ish), as Gunter states.
If the Buwayhids article doesn't mention a relationship with Kurds/Kurdish then that is a failure of that article, not a guide to the content of others. GPinkerton (talk) 16:41, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
According to David Potts's Nomadism in Iran: From Antiquity to the Modern Era (which uses "kurds" to denote groups otherwise designated "Kurds" in historical sources whenever evidence is lacking which could confirm the existence of a clearly defined ethnolinguistic group. while The term "Kurdish" will only be used in a linguistic sense), it was Hamza al-Isfahani who applied the term "kurd/Kurd" to the Daylamites, in the form "kurds of Tabaristan" (cf. the Arabs, whom al-Isfahani described as "kurds of Suristan"), though according to Potts, it would be unwise to assume that all Daylamites were "kurds". I'm not seeing a definiteness that would justify the certainty expressed in utter vast majority. GPinkerton (talk) 17:04, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Something to read?

[55] --Kansas Bear (talk) 01:13, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Your thread has been archived

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About your comment on my talk-page.

Hey,i just want you to know that bistoun, Yazdegerd castle,temple of Anahita,taq-e-bostan were not one of my edits,it were made by other users long ago,so i just didn't touch it and left it as it were.

Also,I added the Zand Architectures [Kulah-e Farangi and among many others] simply because the Zands were as you know,a Kurdish Dynasty.

Another thing is,Ganjali Khan Complex and the Zein-o-din Caravanserai were built by Ganjali Khan, architect and Governor of Kerman who also was a Kurd who was said to maintain ties with his tribe [56] ,so there is really no reason to remove that part.

And dinavar was under the Kurdish Hasawayhids and the center of it in 931, and prospered under them,till it got devastated by the Turks.

Also lastly,Rey Castle was said to have dated appearntly back to the Median Period, and as you know,the Medes may have been one of the Ancestors of Kurds According to a number of sources.

Thanks. Moskerhus (talk) 06:39, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

  • "Also,I added the Zand Architectures [Kulah-e Farangi and among many others] simply because the Zands were as you know,a Kurdish Dynasty."
Eh, no. First of all, the Zands may have been of Kurdish origin:

...the bulk of the evidence points to their being one of the northern Lur or Lak tribes, who may originally have been immigrants of Kurdish origin., Peter Avery, William Bayne Fisher, Gavin Hambly, Charles Melville (ed.), The Cambridge History of Iran: From Nadir Shah to the Islamic Republic, Cambridge University Press, 1991, ISBN 978-0-521-20095-0, p. 64.

Karim Khan, 'the Wakil' (1164-93/1751-79). The founder of the dynasty was Mo?ammad Karim Khan b. In?q Khan (Figure 1; commonly known as Karim Khan Zand) of the Bagala branch of the Zand, a pastoral tribe of the Lak branch of Lors (perhaps originally Kurds; see Minorsky, p. 616).[57]

That means its not certain, i.e. established. Second, even if they were, it still doesn't make their building projects Kurdish sites, unless WP:RS sources specifically say so. Otherwise every building made by Napoleon Bonaparte would be an Italian site, or 19th-century Romanov projects would be German projects. In short; WP:OR, i.e. original research.
  • "Another thing is,Ganjali Khan Complex and the Zein-o-din Caravanserai were built by Ganjali Khan, architect and Governor of Kerman who also was a Kurd who was said to maintain ties with his tribe [58] ,so there is really no reason to remove that part."
The source doesn't say that the Ganjali Khan Complex or the Zein-o-din Caravanserai were Kurdish sites. More WP:OR.
  • "And dinavar was under the Kurdish Hasawayhids and the center of it in 931, and prospered under them,till it got devastated by the Turks."
Do you have a source that says that its a Kurdish site? If not, then thats more WP:OR.
  • "Also lastly,Rey Castle was said to have dated appearntly back to the Median Period, and as you know,the Medes may have been one of the Ancestors of Kurds According to a number of sources."
Unless you have a reliable source that states that the Rey Castle is a Kurdish site, this example will be considered the epitome of WP:OR POV pushing.
If this pattern of irredentist WP:OR / WP:TENDENTIOUS editing continues, I will report you to WP:ANI. Consider this a warning. - LouisAragon (talk) 13:35, 17 February 2021 (UTC)


Kurd%C3%AEmHeval looks like a sock of Kurdishhistorian27 or 1HistoricalCorrecter1 in my opinion. Wario-Man talk 13:15, 20 February 2021 (UTC)

Iranica Brill

Iranica is now freely accessible at Brill btw :d. --HistoryofIran (talk) 15:43, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: Yes I noticed. 14 new entries on Khorasan btw, thats pretty damn neat![59] - LouisAragon (talk) 23:28, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

Helpful information

Muhammad At Medina. --Kansas Bear (talk) 02:04, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

Odd stuff

Both claims rejected by most sources (DNA studies and modern historians). Your thoughts? Wario-Man talk 13:43, 25 February 2021 (UTC)

@Wario-Man: I removed the material per WP:BOLD and WP:VER. Looking at the name of that editor btw, coincidence?[61] - LouisAragon (talk) 15:19, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
Could be just another user but performed problematic edits like this in the past. The addition was an old 2014 edit[62] and see IP's edits on talk page According to another user[63], the IP address belonged to this LTA dude that we know. You yourself have edited that article many times and overlooked such POV content. I just noticed it due to the recent edits like this. Wario-Man talk 15:55, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: Yeah, probably. Good job and thanks for notifying me. - LouisAragon (talk) 12:10, 26 February 2021 (UTC)
Last point: This could be a sockpuppet. See [64], [65], and [66]. This has become a long-term issue on ENWP and SPI isn't effective against them. If you encounter more like those accounts, it's better to report them to WP:AN or WP:ANI and request IP-range block to prevent them from creating new accounts and sock farming. Wario-Man talk 12:43, 26 February 2021 (UTC)
@Wario-Man: You should leave a comment here[67] for the record, for others to see. You're definitely on to something, so keep it up. Please don't hesitate to ping me when you're about to catch these new mice. I'll see what I can do. - LouisAragon (talk) 13:08, 26 February 2021 (UTC)


Heloo.. Why did you reverse the changes I made in this article? Did I break the no original research policy rules? I have used quotes from various authors in my corrections. You call it my research? Please justify returning my corrections. Azerbaijanian 777 (talk) 07:34, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Your addition was a mix between violations of WP:RS and WP:OR analysis, hence WP:TENDENTIOUS. - LouisAragon (talk) 12:08, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Requesting article expansion support


Requesting you to visit articles Islamic advice literature and Draft:Aurats (word)

Pl. also do have a look at Draft:Avret Esir Pazarlar? (An article about Ottoman times female slavery with a special focus on the state of non-elite common women slavery in those times)

and help expand the articles if any of above topics interest you.

Thanks and warm regards

Bookku (talk) 17:42, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

Source drought

Hiya mate, you don't happen to possess some interesting sources that could be of good use to expand/create articles? I'm having a bit of a source drought atm lol. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:20, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: I literally have too many sources at my disposal. The main question is, what topic would you like to work on? :D The amount of top sources that were published in the past few years, and continue to get published every day, is unreal (srs). - LouisAragon (talk) 14:31, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
I'm not too sure, as long as it's not pre-Islamic I guess, I've worked too much on that x). --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:34, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Yeah I figured haha. Hmm lets see. What about early Qajar? Other than Siege of Erivan (1804) we don't have any Qajar GA's and the articles are often a target for heavy ethno-nationalist POV pushing. Otherwise perhaps Afsharid-era? - LouisAragon (talk) 14:37, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
Why not both ;)? --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:44, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Ok what about Agha Mohammad Khan Qajar and Shahrukh Afshar? Or maybe some provincial governors (like Hossein Khan Sardar)? Lemme know what you think, and I will link the sources I have in mind. - LouisAragon (talk) 16:41, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
Ugh, I rather not expand Agha Mohammad Khan Qajar xD, that's too much work, I still have trauma from back when I expanded the article. But yeah, Shahrukh Afshar, Hossein Khan, some random figures, some battles, regions perhaps? --HistoryofIran (talk) 19:56, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Lemme know if this helps:
- LouisAragon (talk) 22:03, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
Hmm, I think I'll start working on Shahrukh, and then Hossein. Could you send me these? [88] [89], [90] [91] [92] --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:12, 3 March 2021 (UTC)
@HistoryofIran: Sent you the Enc of Islam entry, please check your mail.[93] For the Islamica entry,[94] I'm gonna have to ping @Cplakidas: as I can't access it myself. I hope he can help out. As for the two books, you can download them for free here.[95]-[96] - LouisAragon (talk) 22:45, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Rostam al-Tawarikh

Greetings LouisAragon, i have a Question for you: in your opinion, is Rostam al-Tawarikh, a good Source? it is a book written by Mohammad Hashem-Assef in late Fathali shah-early Mohammad Shah Qajar era and it's about Safavids, Afsharid, Zand (specialy Shahroukh Shah Afshar) and Aqa Muhammad Khan. i have both German and Persian versions of book and i thought i could use it as a Source to improve some articles.Amir Ghandi (talk) 19:19, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

@Amir Ghandi: It sounds like a valuable primary source (WP:PRIMARY). It should be attributed correctly though when cited. For example, "According to the Rostam al-Tawarikh, written by Mohammad Hashem-Assef in the first half of the 19th century...". - LouisAragon (talk) 09:14, 2 April 2021 (UTC)
hi thanks for reply, unfortunately i find out that this is a primary source, so i guess i can only use it as a source for quote.Amir Ghandi (talk) 17:16, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

Missing cite in Izydor Borowski

The article cites "Atkin 2013" but no such source is listed in the bibliography. Can you please add? Also, suggest installing a script to highlight such errors in the future. All you need to do is copy and paste importScript('User:Svick/HarvErrors.js'); // Backlink: [[User:Svick/HarvErrors.js]] to your common.js page. Thanks, Renata (talk) 04:01, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

@Renata3: Fixed! Added the script to my common.js page as well. Many thanks for the heads up. - LouisAragon (talk) 21:09, 5 April 2021 (UTC)


why are you removing when she was born to an iranian-azerbaijani-gilaki family not so much to discuss my friend, her dad is iranian-azerbaijani origin and thats according her. Loveisthebest1 (talk) 19:28, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

You write that source dont say that she is azerbajiani origin thats funny, then why are you not chaning to Iranian or some city she come from, or what source say. Loveisthebest1 (talk) 19:50, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Requesting some help


It seems you have previously edited article Black sea or some article which is linked/ connected to Black sea article.

Bookku (talk) 11:24, 18 March 2021 (UTC)

Smith ref request

Greetings, i saw the talk section you once added on March days about this article:

Could you please send it to me? I don't know if there's a policy or protocol for this but feel free emailing it to me. Cheers. - Kevo327 (talk) 10:43, 31 March 2021 (UTC)

@Kevo327: Sure! Can you send me an email? Unfortunately we can't send files through Wiki email, so I would need to "reply" to you in order for me to send it. - LouisAragon (talk) 17:21, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
@Kevo327: Sent! Please check your mailbox. - LouisAragon (talk) 11:02, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

Afsharid Empire - Revised Map

Hello, thanks for your kind attention to the discussion over the map on the Afsharid Dynasty page. I've noticed that it had been inaccurately represented for a long time and had the urge to replace the old map with a more accurate depiction. I was hoping to discuss any edits or revisions to it if you had any in mind, seeing as how the View History section has limited characters for thorough explanations.

I revised the previous edit to include annexed territories in Dagestan but also extended the map's timeline to 1745 to match the historical reference. As for Bowen's map, while it is a primary source, I cross-referenced it with Moll and Lotter's contemporary maps. These maps all confirm each other's estimate for the eastern border at the time. Similarly, while Axworthy is a more updated source, his maps in Sword of Persia and Empire of the Mind are presented as "approximate borders," so his renditions are by no means the dominant source.

I believe the most pragmatic solution is to maintain one map with the clearest indicators (ex: cities that were never annexed, treaties such as Kerden and Constantinople which point to natural borderlands and rivers as the distinction of domains), and the meticulous details can be spared until further research points to the most reliable rendition.

@Cannon223: Thank you for your comment. An updated version based on numerous modern WP:RS (including Abbas Amanat) will most likely be uploaded in some time by @HistoryofIran: - LouisAragon (talk) 17:51, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
@LouisAragon: Thanks for the quick reply, glad to hear. I believe Amanat's map was based more on Nader's campaigns than the political borders of his domain, I could be wrong though. Either way, I'm glad to help in any way I can. If we need to rely on the most recent sources due to guidelines, I'd also suggest Farrokh's map from Iran at War - Cannon223 19:07, 1 April 2021 (UTC)


Hey, a user recently made a change on Saqaliba claiming it means "palefaces" citing a Russian language source [1]. Seeing that you speak Russian, can you verify the statement if you have the time, Thanks --MWahaiibii (talk) 13:11, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

@MWahaiibii: The source, which, first of all, is seemingly a review of the original work, doesn't mention "That is what the term "sakaliba", "light-faces" means". It therefore appears to be a violation of WP:OR, WP:VER and, probably, WP:RS. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:02, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

Map of Fars

hey, is there any Map of Fars in Fath-Ali Shah reign era (especialy between 1790-1830s)?Amir Ghandi (talk) 09:07, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

New article on Iran by the usual "scholar for hire":

Wondering what your thoughts as well as Wario-Man (talk · contribs) are on this [97]

Might be irritating to read but it really makes you question why she's still considered WP:RS here.

Very few of her claims there (or anywhere, really) are backed by references that aren't her previous articles/books, Twitter, Youtube, or blatantly partisan ethno-nationalist websites.

I'm legitimately tempted to file something on WP:RSN at this point. -- Qahramani44 (talk) 00:19, 30 April 2021 (UTC)

@Qahramani44: She is a shill and does have an agenda; e.g. see her claim[98] about Nizami Ganjavi, or take a look at this[99] and her claims there. Just google her name or search her Twitter, and you will find dozens of similar stuff. She's a biased author and her works are not neutral. What articles still cite her? I don't see her name on any important or controversial topic.[100] Wario-Man talk 05:21, 30 April 2021 (UTC)
What an expert...
"Persians comprise at least 50 percent of the population in 12 provinces: Isfahan, Busher, Tehran, North Khorasan, Razavi Khorasan, Semnan, Fars, Qom, Central Kerman, Hormozgan, and Yazd. In the provinces of Alborz, North Khorasan, Khuzestan, and Golestan, Persians do not form the majority but have a strong presence."
And look at the citations in that article. She used some stuff from WP articles/works. Wario-Man talk 09:26, 1 May 2021 (UTC)
@Qahramani44: Yeah this needs to be brought to WP:RSN. Long overdue. - LouisAragon (talk) 18:54, 14 May 2021 (UTC)


Hello, LouisAragon (talk · contribs). How are you doing? I'm here to inform your that one of the articles that may be in your sphere of interest (Magtymguly) was nominated for GA some time ago. The first GA observations have recently been made and the list of need-to-dos has been provided. Subsequently, substantial work is being done against the clock by adding tons of new information and making sizeable changes that I think have probably cut corners (you can check them here). Therefore, I believe that all this begs your professional revision, so I kindly ask for your expertise on this issue. Thank you in advance! --VisioncurveTimendi causa est nescire 05:51, 30 April 2021 (UTC)

Discussion at Talk:Khwarazmian dynasty § Splitting proposal

 You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Khwarazmian dynasty § Splitting proposal. VisioncurveTimendi causa est nescire 06:42, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

Grove Online

Do you have access to this:

I am concerned about this sentence in the Seljuk Empire article:

  • "Many works of Seljuk art continued to be produced following the decline of the empire in the late 12th century, when other dynasties such as the Ghaznavids came into power."

Now we both know the Ghaznavids did not come-into-power in the late 12th century. I already posted a concern on Millsnaps talk page, but have not gotten a response. --Kansas Bear (talk) 00:15, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

@Kansas Bear: I believe this is the relevant excerpt from Grove:

The area within which Saljuq art flourished is often loosely taken to be that of modern Iran, but more of it was outside these political boundaries than within them. Modern scholarship has not progressed far enough to identify the various local schools inside the Iranian world with confidence, though it is clear that the arts of Syria and Anatolia had their own distinctive character. Similarly the chronology of Saljuq art is hard to correlate with political events. The rhythms of stylistic development are not those of dynasties. Typically Saljuq work is found in the early 11th century as in the early 13th, and thus outside the timespan of Saljuq political power. Most Saljuq art in fact dates from the period of Saljuq decline, and extremely similar work in various fields, but notably architecture, was practised under the Ghaznavids, Ghurids, Qarakhanids and Khwarazmshahs, all dynasties that co-existed with or succeeded the Saljuqs proper.

- LouisAragon (talk) 11:27, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
Yeah. So the source does not say the Ghaznavids "came to power" in the late 12th century. --Kansas Bear (talk) 12:31, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
And Millsnaps deleted that part. Thanks for your help, LouisAragon. --Kansas Bear (talk) 12:34, 20 May 2021 (UTC)


Regarding my edit: I don't know how I've read that as NKR instead of Nakchivan. My mistake. Beshogur (talk) 21:51, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

No worries. - LouisAragon (talk) 20:45, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Original research


The template may contain some WP:OR, thus needing some changes. Wario-Man talk 11:15, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Nomination of Da'tid Bahrana for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Da'tid Bahrana is suitable for inclusion in resource according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Resource: Articles for deletion/Da'tid Bahrana until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

IamMM (talk) 16:21, 5 July 2021 (UTC)


Hi Louis,

I have taken a stab at fixing the severely bloated and puffed Aparat article here: I don't think I fixed everything, but at the very least it doesn't read like a press release anymore. Please do me a favor and keep an eye on it. I am concerned that my edits are going to be mass reverted or that the fluff will creep back in, and that does no one any favors. Thank you. (talk) 00:00, 13 July 2021 (UTC)

Azeris are iranian

Hello, please do not interfere in this case when you do not have enough information about it. I am an Azeri myself and I have been researching this issue for several years. You can research it yourself from reliable sources. Azeris are Iranians, not Turks Genetic studies and historical evidence show that Azeris are Iranians and not Turks. In the past, Azeris spoke the Tati language, which has its roots in Persian. The Turks were an immigrant people living in Northeast Asia. The Turks migrated to lands such as Azerbaijan and settled there, and over time they merged with the Azeris, and the Azeri language gradually changed from Tati to Azeri Turkish. Genetic tests show that less than 20% of Azeri genes are Turkish genes and Azeris are among the people of Iranian descent. If you do not agree with me, refer to reliable sources. I will give you the link to the content related to Azeris from Persian and English resource to read them. ? ? ? (talk) 12:50, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

And I apologize for not being able to speak English well and for being a little aggressive at first. I try very hard to inform about the fact that Azeris are Iranians, and there is a kind of pressure on me. Because some profiteers want to separate between Azeris and other Iranians. And on the one hand, some extremists talk about it without any knowledge or research and spread false information about Azeris. And on the one hand, no institution informs and investigates this issue as it should. And I am very upset about this and I am under pressure not to let the truth be lost Sorry ? ? ? (talk) 20:34, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

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